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Aros
Гость
Тема: Святая наивность!)))
 
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Ищущий, вы наивны как детя! Вы что, решили документы на которым гриф секретности искать в открытом интернете?????? А вместе с этими документами срок наматать на свою шею - не боитесь?
Советую - будьте поосторожней во-первых! А во-вторых, перечитайте дискуссию, которая велась несколько дней назад о Чакра-муни на этом форуме - там отклик некого Дива к вопросу, как он безпроблем (и невылезая в инет) приобрел катрены специальной части Чакра-муни. Во всяком случае - это безопасней, чем ждать, когда вам их подкинут для выхода на прямой контакт с вами специальные органы!!! Думать иногда надо!
 
 
05.09.2003 10:16
Локки
Гость
Тема: RE: Olgerd-у и другим, мои выводы по теме Чакра-муни
 
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Господа, если вас интересует кто создавал и для чего современную методику Чакра-муни и почему она до сих пор под грифом - загляните сюда:
http://society.pravda.ru/society/2003/8/27/84/13450_zondirovanie.html
 
 
05.09.2003 11:24
Bloody Guardian
Гость
Тема: Как вы утомили
 
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перетерать за какието - муни... чесное слово. Ведь вроде уже подробно выйснили, что за ними не стоит вообще ничего, кроме пиар-акции для набития цены за их секретную часть. И снова, по второму разу...

Хватит рекламировать здесь эту херню. Или, вы надеетесь, что те, кто спорил с вами, утомяться повторять свои аргументы, тема уйдет вниз, а останутся - только ваши переодические напоминания?

НЕ НАДЕЙТЕСЬ. Если здесь появится еще хоть одно сообщение на эту тему, я лично сделаю подборку ссылок из прошлого обсуждения, и буду его публиковать к каждому новому упоминанию о Чакра-муни.
 
 
05.09.2003 15:17
Эрих
Гость
Тема: RE: А вы меня вообще достали!
 
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А чего вы так разнервничались? Человек дал ссылку на статью в газете - я лично ее прочел с интересом и только укрепился в своем мнении! А вот от вашей лично чуши, которую вы тут обсуждаете сплошь и рядом - уши вянут! И у вас она отторжение не вызывает! Ваш форум надо было назвать не Бешня магов, а Белые столбы!
 
 
05.09.2003 15:32
Pavel
Гость
Тема: RE: Критикуйте!
 
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Вот вам научная статья об этом из английского научного альманаха. Как видете это не наша выдумка!

Essence of existence, the treatise

Its true sources are unknown...It entered as the canon not into one religious system (and therefore it was little-known), but it gave impetus by many...It is known in the different lists, the versions or under the different names in different peoples...It is completely possible that this is the earliest text on the Earth, but its level is paradoxically high.The attempt in the West to literally follow the certain complex technicians (here not bringing) to nothing good they did not lead - were lost even splinters of tradition, if it existed.One, perhaps, is irrefutable...However, word they are superfluous - simply reading, remember that this text was written by our ancestors in the immemorial times.
This transfer/translation of Cakra- Mooney [ literal transfer/translation - " the source of development " - Serg ] was done in the institute of the oriental study of the Academy of Sciences of the USSR even at the end 70- X - beginning of the 80th of years.Quotations from the treatise and commentaries to them are undertaken from the report to prof..V.N.Toporova (LGU) [ now - the academician OF RAN, is more than one-and-a-half thousand printed works, including of monographs - Serg ] at the session of the department of the oriental study of the Academy of Sciences of the USSR in 1986.The target/purpose of report was to draw attention scientific academies to this work and attempt to carry out official publication on this question in the herald of the Academy of Sciences, and then the book about studies.Report caused significant resonance in the scientific circles, but in view of the absence of scientific explanation about the sources, which served as basis for this work, and ideological disputableness from the existed then Marxist-Leninist model of historiography, information about studies was given only in the herald of the Academy of Sciences, extended for the internal use of academy.Unfortunately, given commentaries are altogether only endurances from the report (report itself it was for 4 hours), and therefore the demonstrative and actual base of commentaries here is considerably reduced.

Essence of existence, the report
The reached us ancient esoteric work are existences (Sanskrit name of Cakra- Mooney ) it is, perhaps, most ancient and respected from reached to the present literary- philosophical treatises of human civilization.The source of the origin, which outdistanced on the standard of knowledge humanity to the millenia, does not yield to scientific explanation.Treatise in its essence is not religious document, but nevertheless it exerted enormous influence practically on all theological studies and religions of peace/world.this occurred because the content of treatise considerably exceeded the standard of knowledge of that time and was interpreted in the limits of the understanding by the society of the knowledge placed in the document and truths.The source of the appearance of this treatise is unknown.From the antiquity known several versions of the texts of document.
The ancient Indian source " Of samaranga " narrates about the texts of the Moon, which fell to the earth in the desert of containers for several thousand years to the bloom of the reign Of kharappa, when treatise " By brakhmi " (given the name of most ancient of the known Indian written languages) became basis for the formation of the religious and public structure of society.this, approximately, 3,5 - 4 thousand years B.C. precisely this document marked the beginning of formation to the religious- philosophical trend, known at present as yogi.Later, the texts of treatise " By brakhmi " exerted enormous influence on the formation of a number of the ancient Indian philosophical flows, such as Sankkh'ya (Kapila) and Vaysheshika (Canada, Prashastapada), and also Upanishady.By this time the text of treatise was already known in the early Tokharskikh reigns of Western hindu kush and in the territory of ancient baluchistan (elamskiye characters).
The basis of the ancient-Persian sacred canon of zoroastriytsev avesta became the precepts Of akhuramazdy - the supreme deities of fire/light (Persian name), presented by the prophet Of zoroastroy of approximately 3,5 thousand years ago.But directly very precepts Of akhuramazdy were widely known in the territory Of persii and Central Asia long before the appearance of texts of avesta.Their appearance, apparently, is compared on the time with the advent of this manuscript in the territory of ancient India.
The first references in ancient Egypt about " the will of god Ptakh " (Egyptian name) relate to the period of the early reign of Kem', dynasty of exchanges (first dynasty Of menefona), and they narrate about the godly revelations, which were known to Egyptian priests even for several thousand seasons of rains to the base of white walls (ancient name of Memphis - the subsequently earliest capital of Egypt).If we attempt to conduct simple calculations according to the time, then this also about 4 thousand years B.C. Egyptians considered the source of the origin of texts the ancient killed civilization.
Treatise by the name " the fiery truths Of rubruma " was known To shumerskoy civilization , it is more accurate than the prashumerskoy, long before the appearance Of assirii and Babylon, (so-called reign of Accad).Ancient clay tables reported to us the written down by cuneiform separate fragments of treatise and the version of origin, similar to the ancient Indian.Sound-effects men considered that characters " they went down from the skies ".
Antique Greek historian and philosopher Herodotus, relying on ancient-Egyptian sources, connected the texts of god Ptakh with the mysterious and earliest civilization with Atlantis, which was killed in the abyss of sea 8 - 11 thousand years ago.
By the way, in most ancient Greece texts they knew as " the mysteries of underground god Aida " and they arrived in Greece through The minosskoye reign, apparently, from Egypt.Treatise exerted great influence on the antique philosophy of Greece, different philosophical schools and flows (Fales, Leucippus, Geraklid, Aristotle).
In ancient Tibet Cakra- Mooney treatise is known with II - millenium B.C. texts, apparently, they arrived from India or China.The bloom of Cakra- Mooney in Tibet relates to 9 century B.C., when treatise practically gave the beginning of new in the world religion - to Buddhism.Is considered that the beginning to Buddhism marked Siddartkha Of gautama, " the prince of drevnenepal'skogo principality ", who, uydya to seven years into the mountains, got to know the essence of treatise " in his understanding ".As a result of illumination (Satori), it seemingly tested spiritual regeneration and it began to be called by Buddha, which on Sanskrit means " that clarified by truth ".this marked the beginning of Buddhism as religions.
In ancient China the symbolic interpretation of the basic condition/positions of treatise was given in the earliest basic philosophical labor Of idzin (book of changes).Subsequently, the basic condition/positions of treatise became the basis of the main philosophical schools of ancient China:Taoism (Laotszy, Chzhuantszy), confucianisms (Konfutsiy, Mentszy) and the school of moistov (Motszy).
In the territory of roman empire in the beginning I - II century A.D. the texts of treatise became the basis of the religious- philosophical trend - gnosticism, which in II - III centuries became on the influence the main rival of early Christianity (Vasilid, Geraklean, Karpokrat).It is natural that the interpretation of texts in the gnosticism and their philosophical comprehension it was given at the standard of knowledge of its time, with the large admixture/impurity of mystical and ritual ideas and cults, which passed during as the synthesis of ancient-eastern ideas about the treatise.
For poslednii two - three centuries were done repeated attempts at the transfer/translation of the texts of treatise into the European languages and their comprehensions.Unfortunately, one attempt at the interpretation of texts cannot be recognized sufficiently successful.Nevertheless, treatise had a significant effect on the philosophical views of the number of European thinkers (Bacon, Spinoza, Lomonosov, Volterras, Spencer, Haeckel, S. Bulgakov, Young).
Since to humanity is known this esoteric work, with its knowledge connect that staggering, almost mystical, the transformation of people.It was considered that the one who gets to know as a whole the sense of treatise, gets to know the truth of existence, to him will be opened/discovered peace/world completely from other side, and it will acquire new abilities in light of the changed knowledge and the new views on the life, the peace/world, the sense of existence.During entire history of humanity, one way or another connected/bonded with the knowledge of the sense of that placed in the texts, only the units of people could get to know the sense of these manuals.In particular, in their Buddhism they added to Amitabe - to living Buddha.
Now directly about the texts.Their precise quantity is unknown.Only several relative to ancient documents with a different quantity of verses (sometimes there are no rhymed, sometimes, in consequence of which about the verses it is possible to speak only conditionally) up to now reached.Semantic load in the verses, in the different languages, is also different.Each version of the text of treatise before reaching us, was translated from language into language dozens of times.Not always translators could find the equivalent value of words during the transfers/translations, some values are completely lost, in others changed the sense so that, the specific distortions of initial text were inevitable, for example, in Sanskrit it is more than 20 concepts of the spaces, but in the present transfer/translation their 4-5, which substitute majority of the values.the same can be said about such terms and concepts as spirit, soul, field, reason, which are characterized by a significant quantity of semantic interpretations, which do not have contemporary analogs.


 
 
05.09.2003 16:07
Ищущий
Гость
Тема: RE: Святая наивность!)))
 
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Просто было очень поздно.
Вот и написал.
(Но адрес-то все же не дал...)
Ладно.
Будет времечко - покопаемся в других ветках этого форума.
(А, случаем, не помните как та ветка называлась?)

А за что срок-то.
Не уж то на самом деле всё так серьезно...

 
 
05.09.2003 16:29
Безымянный
Гость
Тема: Можно только один вопрос?
 
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[Is considered that the beginning to Buddhism marked Siddartkha Of gautama, " the prince of drevnenepal'skogo principality ", who, uydya to seven years into the mountains, got to know the essence of treatise " in his understanding ".]

Мне не понятно слово "uydya" ))) Ни в одном английском словаре не нашел, верите ли. Просветите, пожалуйста )))



 
 
05.09.2003 16:35
Ищущий
Гость
Тема: RE: RE: Критикуйте!
 
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In Russian. Please.

А-то переводить лень...
 
 
05.09.2003 16:35
Безымянный
Гость
Тема: Также внушают подозрение
 
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слова "zoroastriytsev", "minosskoye reign", "idzin (book of changes)" (кажется, по-анлгийски это транскрибируется как i-ching), и еще много чего...


Почему-то мне кажется, что это пришло к нам не из "английского научного альманаха"... Развейте мои подозрения, указав название, год издания и прочие опознавательные знаки "альманаха"...

А то больно на перевод с русского похоже ))) Причем быстрый и не профессиональный ))
 
 
05.09.2003 16:52
Фармазон
Гость
Тема: БРАВО!!!! %)))))))
 
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ну как-же.... так и переводится... "уйдя (к каким-то там) семи годам(почему имя и фамилия с маленькой буквы?) в горы" и принс древненепальского(drevnenepal'skogo).... так вообще мне безумно понравился %))))))))

Безыч, молодец что прочитал.... я так по умолчанию решил что это перевод с русского и читать не стал.... а оказывается это перевод с русского скорее всего программным переводчиком который незнакомые слова транслитом гонит %))))))

 
 
05.09.2003 17:04

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